848 vs. Gixxer 750

I take some issue with "Sport Rider" complaints about the 848.  "It's too skinny..."  Well thats because it's a twin, they are skinny. If you wanna hang on to a fat chick thats cool.  I'd rather get to it with a skinny Italian.  What's with all the bitching about comfort?  I thought the name on the rag was "Sport Rider"? Since when does dragging knee's and shredding asphault have anything to do with boring drones down the interstate? I just rode my 1098S to Monterey and back to San Diego.  Sure my hands are still numb and my ass looks like a Baboon's.  It hurt so good!  If you wanna roll a cookie cutter 750 and be comfortable thats cool. If you jump on a dedicated sport bike like the 848 off that 750 and tell me it's too skinny.  Dude, you got problems.  You gonna jump on Valentino's Yamaha and tell me it's too skinny?  Cause that bike is smaller than the 848, I've seen it. If your looking to make the Suzuki win, then you'll find a way. Ergo's, Too Skinny, Vague front end...  blah blah blah.  You can't tell me that V-Twin around town didn't have it off the line?  Or the coolest sound!  Most looks!  Sure Ducati's are expensive, but they've got something the Japanese have engineered out.  SOUL!  That's what was missing from you comparo.  What makes a Spicy Meatball!!!  The spice damnit.  

I could not agree any more.  

So "soul", looks, and sound are what make the 848 better than the 750?

define soul beyond; I paid more for the ducati so it has to be cooler.

Is the Gix a "cookie cutter 750" because its the same as all the other brands 750's?

the Gix and 848 are dead even on the track yet suzuki manages to make it liveable on the street (where the majority of miles are ridden) and for cheaper.

If you want a babboon ass, get a whip and hand it to your skinny italian chick. The 848 is good the Gixxer is better.  

Take a look at the average 5 year old Gixxer, then look at an average 5 year old Ducati....  The Ducati holds up over time. The Gixxer is ready for the scrap heap.  Also, the Soul of the Ducati reminds me of why I ride in the 1st place, it is not the point A to B that matters but the enjoyment I get on the trip.  If I wanted to ride a couch, I would stay at home. As for equal on the track, Ducati has been the most successful manufacturer in the SBK series over the years, accumulating 14 manufacturer championships with Suzuki claiming only one championship.  So, the numbers may look the same but where the rubber meets the track there seems to be a big difference.  That is a shame as Suzuki is a $30 billion corporation and has a much bigger budget for racing than Ducati.  Ducati's budget was only $32 million dollars in 2004 and shared between MotoGP and Superbike.  So, if the bike is so much better, why only one manufacturer championships?   On a Side note; Given this I gotta give a big round of applause to Yoshimura Suzuki's Ben Spies and Mat Mladin here in the AMA doing so great with their ride.  

I like Ducati dont get me wrong, I just disagree with most of what is being said here.

Firstly, A five year old DUC doesnt hold a candle performance wise to a five year old "ready for the scrap heap" Gixxer. (You should be extremly excited with what DUC has done over the last while in terms of perormance and value)

Suzuki's Gixxer does what the Duc's are doing in terms of performance while STILL making the bikes relatively comfortable.

Comparing DUC and Suzuki's racing efforts to the bikes they are producing for public consumption doesn't factor into this comparison one iota. (and Suzuki has done quite well on the world stage in racing anyway.)

Like I said I'm not calling down DUC but the Original post panning Sport rider for picking the better bike in a comparison and luading the fact that a DUC is uncomfortable to ride doesn't make sense at all.  

Please know I deeply respect your right to disagree with the O.P. and I.

The bike Ducati is putting on the road has much more in common to their race bike than Suzuki's, but both have  a lot in common with the bikes they put on the track.

Also in the 42 years I have been riding, I have yet to see a Suzuki keep up with a Ducati on the street given the riders skill sets and the bikes are similar.  Also, I have done laps and ridden both the GSX 600, 750 and 1000 and I like them.  They are just missing that undefinable spark that makes me want to ride, that makes me get up early to race the sunrise at least 100 miles for my morning cup of coffee. That is why I now own a Ducati, a 2001 996bip, that this old fart dusts the younin's on their 750 and 1000 GSXs new and old.  So, from personal experiences, I feel your wrong when you say "A five year old DUC doesn't hold a candle performance wise to a five year old "ready for the scrap heap" Gixxer". It is not just horsepower and torque, it is how the bike works as a whole with the rider.  I also never owned a Suzuki that lasted and looked good after 5 years of track and street riding. When I worked for a Honda & Yamaha dealer and sold motorcycles, we never gave much for trade in on a used Suzuki GSX, they were always in need of a lot of repair and just plain trashed.  The Ducatis held their value as well as being better maintained.  Maybe that says more about the owners of both brands than the bikes. However, I will give you the point that the current GXR750 was more comfortable for the "authors" over the 848 in their comparison, in other publications you may well find other results regarding both bikes.  It depends on what is important to the individual rider, some will opt for the comfort of the "cookie cutter" Gixxer, others will prefer the unforgiving "Soul" of the 848.  It depends on what YOU want and none of us should chose a motorcycle only on what we read in the motor cycle journals, they are the opinion of the writers and what matters to them.  You may or may not agree with them when you finally get on the motorcycle.  Until we ride them both, we will not know which bike is better for you or I.  Take what they wrote and use it as a guide-line, but pick the bike on your own experiences and the way it makes YOU feel.  If your bike makes you live to get up in the morning and race the sun across the sky, you picked the right bike, if not your on the wrong motorcycle. Again let me finish by saying, I deeply respect your right to disagree.

Just for fun I will list the bikes I remember that I have owned that made me feel like they had that spark or Soul, Honda QA50, my 1st "real" bike. The Hodaka Dirt Squirt and Super Rat, I still have a 1974 Dirt Squirt, pulls the tire off the ground in all 5 gears, and I cannot find new parts, and new dirt bikes are light years faster but still. The Yamaha XS650 (god that bike was crap but I loved it and owned two) The Kawasaki GPZ 750, hard to turn but a pleasure to ride, The Carburated version of the Honda Black Bird 1100xx, she was a velvet hammer I rode her to an "indicated" 189MPH.  The Ducati 996bip, cause women always ask for a ride and I can still drag a scabby old knee when I am alone.  

I feel the whole discussion is ridiculous.

Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of both philosophies (cause they are completely different bikes IMO). But justifying your purchase whilst trashing other peoples' choices is a joke. And so are you. Don't know about you people riding in the MotoGP or something like that...are you kidding me?...I ride on the street.

Each bike can outperform the other in certain areas. Say what you want, but a duc is NOT as reliable compared to a Japanese bike. If you think else wise then you simply refuse to look at the truth. And no, it is NOT as comfortable and it's not performing the same.

On the other side, riding a twin will never be the same as riding a 4. And yes, riding a duc down the street will never feel the same as riding a suzuki. The GSXR paint scheme is damn ugly too.   The 'zuki will also never get the looks from people as a ducati will.[/Rant]

Stop fighting like badly informed fools.  

GConn,

1st off I think you need to learn the difference between "Reliable" and "Maintenance".  Yes Ducati is known for needing more "Maintenance" than the Japanese manufacturers, but that is not the same as being less reliable.  Also, other then the Desmo valves on the Ducati, the maintenance schedule is very similar for both bikes in question.

As for the rest, you seem to be the only one upset and I do not think that IBdesmo,  superdave  or I are "trashing" each others choices or being insulting to each other.  We are just having here the same friendly discussion we would have about an article we read in "Sport Rider" if we were to meet up on a ride.  If it upset you on behalf of us all may I apologize.

As for us being "badly informed fools" How long have you been riding?  How long have you been so well informed?

For me it has been over 42 years now on the street with short ventures on small flat tracks, and some motocross in the 70s.  I have sold Honda, Yamaha and Ducati Motorcycles.  I have Owned Suzukis, Hondas, Yamahas, Harleys, Hodakas, Ducatis and ridden MV Agustas, Moto Guzzis, Husqvarnas, KTMs BMWs and others. I have even ridden the new version of the Mondial, with the Honda rc51 motor. I have ridden Motorcycles in the USA, Germany, France England, Spain, Italy and most of the rest of Europe.  

So, That makes me a badly informed fool?

I think The others in this post and on the forums will agree that it just makes me an opinionated old fart.  

lets be real, the japanese bikes rule.  you get more performance value for your money.  in the real world, especially in this crappy economy, that's what matters to me.  parts are easily accessible online or at your local bike shop making maintaining a japanese bike yourself very easy.  the aftermarket is far more extensive for japanese brand bikes than it is for italian brand bikes.  Robi, i hate to tell you but your missing out on a lot of performance and innovation if your riding a 2001 996 just because it has soul.  I don't know what guys you've been racing against, but i would sure like to take a shot at you on my CBR.  

redwingrider,

I hope we do get to ride together someday it will be fun.  I have owned the Japanese made bikes, and I can tell you I am missing nothing.  Daniela my 996 has an updated suspension, setup for me by the shop's race team. The motor has about $5000 just in each head, valve work cams along with a perfect port and polish job, FBF High Comp Pistons with Corello rods, a lightened and balanced Fly wheel and crank shaft are just some of the modifications. But I agree with you after having test rode a new cbr1000 and a new r1, I am impressed with their performance from a stock bike.  I am also in love with the look and ride of the 1098, I just do not find enough of a increase to trade Daniela for any of them.  But that is not the point I was tiring to get across and no-one seems to get.  That point is that YOU should pick a bike that is right for you.  For you it is your CBR, for me it is my Duc... My brother still rides a Harley Road King, it fits the way he rides, for HIM it is the BETTER BIKE.  What ever you do, DO NOT buy a bike because someone else told you it is a "Better Bike", do not buy that any bike is better than the other because some writers for "Sport Rider, or "MCN" or "Performance Bike" and or any Magazine tells you it was a better bike for YOU because THEY could go 1/2 second faster or more round what ever track or down their favorite road. Buy the bike that moves you, inside, outside and as YOU ride it down the road.  Besides the writers on other sites and in other articles, liked the 848 better than the GSXr, Their story is that the 848 is better on track and street than the GSXr is. So as riders, who should we believe?  

Me; I trust my riding experience and get the bike that fits me, that makes me live to ride one more mile and I am glad you did the same.  

P.S. I traded my Honda for the Ducati, and I do not miss the Honda one little bit.  

i understand fully what you are saying and i agree with a lot of what you are saying.  I would be foolish to not listen to someone with the experience that you have; you are wise.  unfortunately for me, i do not have the financial luxury to ride and purchase as many different machines as you have.  would i like to own a 1098? maybe.  i'm sure its an awesome machine, but given the current landscape of the sportbike world, japanese makes offer me a more accesible barn storming machine.  its hard to argue with the bottom line numbers.  thats all that i am saying.  

Thanks!

Also I hear you there, depending on were you live, the disposable income you have, and how long are you keeping the bike and can you get it repaired localy?  These factors should be considered as well when looking for your "soulmate" in a motorcycle. Price is a big factor, even the Japanese motorcycles are out of reach for people now in the economy.  I know it would keep me from trading bikes right now if I wanted to.

Still, some, will trade as soon as there is an upgrade and never keep a motorcycle for five years, others get a bike and keep it for life or till it dies.  Or in my case I may die 1st

I am lucky enough to live in San Francisco where I am exposed to a lot of brands and get to ride them all. Here I have a bike as my main transportation.  For years I did not own a car or "Practical" car, so the bike was/is my way to work.

I also still learn a lot from all of you guys as well. I meet a big diverse group of riders here and some, old and young, blow me away with what they know and how well they ride. I will never know it all and would be a complete @$$ if I told you I did.  What I have written here is my opinion, just like the writers  of the articles here...IT is an opinion.  Take from it what works for you but never make my opinion or the opinion of others YOUR gospel.  Find your own path, your own bike and ride it like you would die if you stopped.

Keep your Skull up and the Rubber parts down, I hope we all get to go on a long ride together some day.

P.S. Did you all love the fight for 2nd and 3rd in the last MOTO GP?  

I just had to add this link for fun, great video with two opposing views given about the bikes.  It seems to reinforce both sides of the debate here.

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/buildasx.aspx?v=08_duc848_gsxr750.wmv

You might have to cut and paste the URL to open the link.  Enjoy  

rode a 1098s side by side with my 07' 600rr.........dont care for the v-twin, prefer my in-line 4....also dont like the ergos on the 1098s.  i love my honda, not one complaint.......its perfect for ME.  wouldn't mind the front and rear ohlins suspension on the honda though!  lol! godspeed.