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Posted: 06/12/05
07:23 PM
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I use the clutch tap method - depress clutch lever .25 to 1
inch only when up-shifting.
Preferences?
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SWATGeek
User
| Posts: 95
| Joined: 05/05
Posted: 06/13/05
06:10 AM
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Clutchless! With the exception of 1-2 in traffic ![]()
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Posted: 06/13/05
06:44 AM
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I never do clutchless on 1-2, otherwise almost always if the revs are up somewhat.
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Posted: 06/13/05
03:10 PM
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I use the clutch all the time. Almost.... The only exception for me is when I am going kinda slow. Then I do a clutchless upshift from 5th to 6th. Even at 60 mph, my 10R only drops a coupld hundred rpm going from 5th to 6th. Close ratio transmision...
Chris
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Posted: 06/15/05
01:50 PM
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When riding hard I tap the clutch on the 1-2 shift otherwise my Hawk's tranny protests the command. After that I just tap it into the next gear sans clutch.
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max600
New User
| Posts: 44
| Joined: 11/99
Posted: 06/16/05
10:42 AM
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Clutchless for all but 1-2. Most modern bikes are smoother wiht a clutchless upshift. The 1-2 gap is always a problem though because it's usually a big step in the gearing and your crossing over neutral. In fast riding and/or the twisties, clutching usually upsets the bike.
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Posted: 06/17/05
07:41 PM
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is there any real trick to clutchless upshifting? sounds kind of scary. do you have to wait for the revs to be at a certain point?
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Posted: 06/18/05
03:42 PM
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No tricks at all...just tap it into gear sans clutch. My Hawk doesn't have a close ratio or real racy tranny but it is smooth as long as my throttle hand is smooth. I usually only go clutchless when pushing hard so im at least above 7500rpm (redline at 9500) and I just stop pullin' throttle when I tap er' in otherwise it can get choppy...likewise if you cut off the throttle too much (be smooth just as when using the clutch). Some people shift pretty much all the time without the clutch. It upsets the chassis less and allows quicker more consistent shifts, plus it will save some wear on your clutch plates. ![]()
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Posted: 06/18/05
05:09 PM
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does it hurt the transmission at all?
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Posted: 06/18/05
06:16 PM
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I have been shifting like this for a while now and I have not had any tranny problems. I read an article either in sportrider or motorcyclist about clutchless upshifting. Stated something about testing at a local track and they thought there was an epidemic of slipping clutches due to high speed clutch shifting. Article then went on to explain this method and that since moto trannies are different from cars it doesn't hurt the box yadyadayada
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Tinker
New User
| Posts: 13
| Joined: 06/05
Posted: 06/26/05
05:24 PM
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Quote:
is there any real trick to clutchless upshifting? sounds kind of scary. do you have to wait for the revs to be at a certain point?
I haven't used a clutch to upshift in 28 years. It's so easy it's a joke. Here's an easy way to get the hang of it. Ride along in 2nd gear holding the throttle at a steady RPM about 1/3 of the way to redline, then apply a little 'up' pressure on the shifter until you can feel the shifter through your boot, then just let off the gas abruptly and it will jump right into the next higher gear. Remember to maintain the pressure, or increase it slightly as you start to shut off the throttle, then once you feel it click, just roll on the throttle again. You don't have to roll it all the way off either, just enough so the bike releases the friction between the selected gears. Once you get it once, you've got it, then you can experiment with shift points and throttle position, you don't always have to be 1/3 of the way to redline, it's just a good place to learn and practice, but once you master it, you can do quiet little clickers while rolling through traffic, to redline jammers with just a momentary flick of the throttle. Easy as fallin off a log, and I've never had to replace a clutch cable in less than a ridiculous amount of time.
Having said that, I have never ridden a Harley either, so I'm not sure if the gears mesh or the shifter forks are the same, so you would have to ask a Harley person about them.
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glen
New User
| Posts: 6
| Joined: 06/05
Posted: 06/30/05
05:57 AM
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ok i didn't know you could do that on purpose now can you downshift without the clutch
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TEvo
Enthusiast
| Posts: 320
| Joined: 10/02
Posted: 06/30/05
06:36 AM
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Sure... just have to be even more precise and smoother if you want to do a clutchless downshift.
May not make you a faster rider (unless you drag race) but it may help if, someday, somehow, you end up with a broken clutch cable. ![]()
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Goose
New User
| Posts: 31
| Joined: 01/05
Posted: 06/30/05
10:44 AM
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Heven to Betsy No!!! No No NO. Don't try this until your ready to screw something up or feel very confident about matching your ground or tranny speed to that of the motor, and you'll still screw something up unless your going real slow.. You can upshift without the clutch because the transmission is being unloaded when you snap the throttle forward momentairly while applying pressure to the shift lever (thus making the clutches job obsolete--which is to unload preassures to or from the motor). It would be almost impossible to downshift smoothly without the clutch Why? because you cant blip the throttle to match the revs necessary to mate correctly with the lower gear. if you dont realese the turning wheel and transmission from the motor how is the motor going to get to the necessary revs, usually a couple thousand above the next gear, to match correctly? IT WONT. The compression breaking will not allow it. The standard clutch isnt even enough sometimes when your trying to match revs for the downshift, which is why guys or the factory installs a slipper clutch. Trust me if you could downshift without why would ALL guys use the clutch, and some even use a slipper clutch.
TeVO is wrong. Sorry bud (TeVO) not everyone was gods gift to the world like me!!!LOL And why would you be downshifting while dragracing. Unless you skipped over 2nd while shifting from first, and went into third and had to downshitf to second again . . . . what? or do you start dragracing in six and then shift down .---that would be the funniest thing i would ever see.
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TEvo
Enthusiast
| Posts: 320
| Joined: 10/02
Posted: 06/30/05
11:12 AM
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Perhaps there is a failure to communicate here.
It goes without saying clutchless downshifting has no application for dragracing. Better be wearing a carbon fiber jockstrap if you want to downshift here. ![]()
I meant clutchless shifting as a whole has dubious use for most riding situations. Are we looking to shave tenths of a second while cruising on the street? Heck, I'd wager most riders (myself included) can make bigger lap time improvements on trackdays if we focused on fundamentals like deeper braking points, better lines and higher corner speed rather than clutchless shifting.
Impossible to downshift smoothly without the clutch? Keep maintenance throttle, preload the lever and downshift sans clutch. Troy Bayliss used to do this all the time during his WSB days wtih Ducati.
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